Mets & Angels GMs canned

[Needle Juice]

No other teams were allowed to trade draft picks, why should it be allowed now?

[Colby]

I would like to add that my enthusiasm over this matter is not due to my positon as a GM of a competing team in the NL Central that benefits from the Reds major league crop getting worse.  I like this deal because it

a) improves activity of league with added passion - if that was possible with Dan
b) takes one moribound franchise and a competing major league team, throws them together with opposite markets, and comes out gold on both sides
c) deal instantly improves the value of teams in the league as a whole as the old Mets are replaced with the new look Reds

Contingent on small deals passing, the new Reds GM would be scrutinized and would have to be a ProFSL veteran such as tarheels55 - he is our leading replacement GM followed by bigbenxl786.

[Colby]

DEAL #1 - Big money star for replacement star, money, and the #1 prospect
receives
C Harper, Bryce, $0.5m (P-n/a)
OF Wells, Vernon, $18m (2014) + $14m/year from Mets

receives
OF Hamilton, Josh, $18m (2015)

DEAL #2 - Liability move for the Reds to gain a couple prospects and clear books
receives
SP Harvey, Matt, $0.5m (P-n/a)
OF Murphy, Daniel, $0.5m (P-2012)

receives
X-SP Buehrle, Mark, Cash Exchange on Contract, $-5m in 2011
X-SP Buehrle, Mark, Released Under Contract, $7m in 2011
X-SP Garland, Jon, Released Under Contract, $2m (2012), $3.5m in 2011
X-SP Kazmir, Scott, Released Under Contract, $3m (2012), $6m in 2011
OF Lind, Adam, $16.5m (2011)

DEAL #3 - The Rasmus - Hicks deal, Reds don't plan on signing Rasmus, trade him away a year early for prospects
receives
OF Hicks, Aaron, $0.5m (P-n/a)
SP Ranaudo, Anthony, $0.5m (P-n/a)
MI Sano, Miguel Jean, $0.5m (P-n/a)

receives
OF Rasmus, Colby, $0.5m (P-2012)

DEAL #4 - Firesale of other supporting star talent for Singleton, mid-level specs and replacements
receives
SP Archer, Chris, $0.5m (2012)
C Bethancourt, Christian, $0.5m (P-n/a)
CI Blake, Casey, $6m (2011)
OF Gross, Gabe, $0.5m (2011)
CI Singleton, Jonathan, $0.5m (P-n/a)
MI Havens, Reese, $0.5m (P-n/a)

receives
C Thole, Josh, $1.5m (2013)
MI Beckham, Gordon, $0.5m (P-2012)
P Ni, Fu-Te, $0.5m (2011)
X-MI Roberts, Brian, Cash Exchange on Contract through 2013, $3.5m in 2011
OF Snider, Travis, $0.5m (P-2012)

DEAL #5 - Similar to Lind sell, dumping of future Burnett liability + $9m in cap liabilities for additional farmhands
receives
OF Neal, Thomas, $0.5m (P-n/a)
MI Profar, Jurickson, $0.5m (P-n/a)

receives
SP Burnett, A.J., $16.5m (2013)
X-SP Burnett, A.J., Cash Exchange on Contract, $6m (2012), $-16.5m in 2011
X-RP Broxton, Jonathan, Cash Exchange on Contract through 2012, $6.5m in 2011
OF Russell, Kyle, $0.5m (2011)
X-OF Upton, Justin, Cash Exchange on Contract through 2012, $2.5m in 2011

With all of this said, I believe the official roster is not up-to-date, but these deals are a lot easier to analyze then one major deal.  You can rationalize it as a series of a deals in a franchise shifting movement.

[Mr.TradeKing]

As I said, we can throw in picks... and we could also breakdown the mass deal into smaller deals to quantify it better...

I believe a series of smaller trades is the best solution, so that we can 1 by 1 examine them. I am afraid that there is just too much MLB talent being traded to the Mets. Yes, I understand they are getting some highly ranked prospects, but that is exactly what they are....prospects.

~MTK

[Colby]

I agree with what Rob said earlier completely.....Your trading very good mlb for minor league talent. The trade would not be approved in a normal situation. Maybe im being to harsch, but I dont think so.....Ill stay away and see what the rest of the east and central think

As I said, we can throw in picks... and we could also breakdown the mass deal into smaller deals to quantify it better...

[bravesfan4]

I agree with what Rob said earlier completely.....Your trading very good mlb for minor league talent. The trade would not be approved in a normal situation. Maybe im being to harsch, but I dont think so.....Ill stay away and see what the rest of the east and central think

[Colby]

We could also swap some picks.... Forgot to mention that.

[Colby]

My proposal... it includes swap of draft picks to compensate talent differential and shift of franchise directions.  The point of this is not to just give Dan a Mets logo in his profile.  He can do that anywhere, and I believe he is already doing that with RFGM.  The point is to put passion behind the imaginary front desk of a franchise in this league.  Dan's passion will be driven by the team name, the market, its schedule, its history in the league, and some of the players he worked hard to bring to the Reds.  The new look Reds would accept this deal as it puts them into the prototypical, youthful small market franchise making them easier to attract than the current Mets.  The goal of filling turnover is to make up for what past GMs did wrong, keep the realism of the league, and when possible, put fans in the GM seats of their favorite franchises.  Here goes...

Cincinnati Reds receive 15 players for $16.5m
SP Archer, Chris, $0.5m (2012)
C Bethancourt, Christian, $0.5m (P-n/a)
CI Blake, Casey, $6m (2011)
OF Gross, Gabe, $0.5m (2011)
C Harper, Bryce, $0.5m (P-n/a)
SP Harvey, Matt, $0.5m (P-n/a)
MI Havens, Reese, $0.5m (P-n/a)
OF Hicks, Aaron, $0.5m (P-n/a)
OF Murphy, Daniel, $0.5m (P-2012)
OF Neal, Thomas, $0.5m (P-n/a)
MI Profar, Jurickson, $0.5m (P-n/a)
SP Ranaudo, Anthony, $0.5m (P-n/a)
MI Sano, Miguel Jean, $0.5m (P-n/a)
CI Singleton, Jonathan, $0.5m (P-n/a)
OF Wells, Vernon, $18m (2014) + $14m/year from Mets

New York Mets receive 10 players for $64m
MI Beckham, Gordon, $0.5m (P-2012)
SP Burnett, A.J., $16.5m (2013)
X-SP Burnett, A.J., Cash Exchange on Contract, $6m (2012), $-16.5m in 2011
X-RP Broxton, Jonathan, Cash Exchange on Contract through 2012, $6.5m in 2011
X-SP Buehrle, Mark, Cash Exchange on Contract, $-5m in 2011
X-SP Buehrle, Mark, Released Under Contract, $7m in 2011
X-SP Garland, Jon, Released Under Contract, $2m (2012), $3.5m in 2011
OF Hamilton, Josh, $18m (2015)
X-SP Kazmir, Scott, Released Under Contract, $3m (2012), $6m in 2011
OF Lind, Adam, $16.5m (2011)
P Ni, Fu-Te, $0.5m (2011)
OF Rasmus, Colby, $0.5m (P-2012)
X-MI Roberts, Brian, Cash Exchange on Contract through 2013, $3.5m in 2011
OF Russell, Kyle, $0.5m (2011)
OF Snider, Travis, $0.5m (P-2012)
C Thole, Josh, $1.5m (2013)
X-OF Upton, Justin, Cash Exchange on Contract through 2012, $2.5m in 2011
OF Russell, Kyle, $0.5m (2011)

The Reds will go to a full 40 player roster.  The Mets payroll increases to $180m, right up against their cap.  Dan stays in similar situation, but loses out on his keepsake ornaments called Delmon Young and Ian Stewart.  However, he enters a new team with some improved veteran pitchers, has low minor prospects ont he EDR, and picks up a serviceable Beltran.  The biggest relief for Dan is the increased cap next year.  What the Reds truly lose here is Rasmus (due for a pay raise by 2012), Hamilton (nearly 25% of Reds' salary), Lind (more liability than anything), and Beckham.  They gain the piece of mind from the loss of liabilities and become one of the best farms.  Since the MLB focus is on the lineup, the new Reds will sport a lineup that looks like the following.

C ___
CI Belt, Brandon, $0.5m (P-n/a)
CI Blake, Casey, $6m (2011)
MI Figgins, Chone, $3m (2011)
MI ____
OF Wells, Vernon, $18m (2014)
OF Murphy, Daniel, $0.5m (P-2012)
OF Gross, Gabe, $0.5m (2011)

Not sure who the C/MI would be, but there are more producers in this rebuilding Reds team than many of our bottom foes.  The new GM's responsibility will be to fill those holes right away.

The lineup will have

C Romine, Austin, $0.5m (P-n/a)
MI Hamilton, Billy, $0.5m (P-n/a)
C-OF Harper, Bryce, $0.5m (P-n/a)
MI Havens, Reese, $0.5m (P-n/a)
OF Hicks, Aaron, $0.5m (P-n/a)
CI Singleton, Jonathan, $0.5m (P-n/a)

all waiting to make an impact this by the end of 2012.  The Reds will have plenty of money to spend and be a dream franchise to run.  With potential FA contributors available now, the team could fill out its lineup, make some trades to optimize the system, and have plenty of cash to make it competitive in 2012.  Their pitching staff will be led by Happ, Narveson, and Lohse.  Tallet, Hill, and Reyes could contribute to the rotation, but there are FA out there.

[Mr.TradeKing]

I think it would be best to do:

3 players
AJ Burnett
Draft Picks

for

The Met's top 6 prospects
Vernon Wells (contract covered for the duration of the contract)
Draft Picks

This leaves the Reds in a decent standing to at least compete and keep up their salary cap.

~MTK
This leaves the reads

[Needle Juice]

I am going to draw up a proposal.  The move has to be fair and balanced.  I really should not have said that the TC should rule with special circumstance as they should rule on the trade as always.

Colby, when you said "special circumstances", I think you really meant "Look at the big picture", not just the trade.  Consider all things like Cap implications, Team and League Health for the Future, Fair value, etc.  These things are not always factored in when voting on Anthony Slama for Diory Hernandez. 

It isn't a big deal, you are doing the right things by seeing if this can be worked out.

Corey made some very good points in his post.