POLL: EDR Roster or MiLB Roster - A Vote by RC Members Only

[Flash]

Even though the original proposal to keep the EDR Roster in tact and add 5 MiLB roster spots received enough affirmative votes to be enacted, it would seem, from the discussion, that it is the proper time to decide whether we should replace our EDR roster with a more fluid MiLB roster.

The time for endless discussion on this issue has really gotten us nowhere because it seems with every post we keep going in circles.  Our league members need a definitive answer so we can move on to other issues.  Therefore, I have setup this poll so the members of the Rules Committee can finally cast their vote on this issue.  Comments are not required, but you're welcome to do so if you feel so inclined.  The Poll will be up for FIVE DAYS, and hopefully, we will finally put this issue to bed.

The original proposal to add 5 MiLB roster spots to our existing EDR roster has been purposely left off as a choice because it seemed, from the discussion, the RC was not completely sold on it, but only favored it as an alternative to our current EDR roster.

If the EDR roster is replaced by an MiLB roster, our EDRs will become MiLB players, there will be no increase in roster size (and the fears of losing 150 players from the Free Agent pool will be alleviated), and it will still be governed by these rules:

Any player may be placed in the minors at any time, as long as they fall under the following requirements:

Determining rookie status:

- A player shall be considered a rookie unless, during a previous season or seasons, he has (a) played in 50 games (position player) or (b) accumulated 40 IP (pitcher) in the Major Leagues.

- A player that is over these limits is not eligible to be SENT to the Minors.  However, if a player already in the minors hits these limits he may remain in the minors indefinitely.  GM's are not forced to promote players that hit the threshold.  The limit is only for sending a player to the minors.

- A player must be on a P-20XX contract to be eligible.

- An MiLB player's contract would not count against the team salary cap.

[joeshmoe]

This RC should close the loopholes of leaving players on minor league rosters but allowing them to score. It takes two sentences to fix this. Furthermore, if we do eliminate EDR for kiln we should not add five more roster spots. 60 is enough.

Lastly players should not be allowed to sit in minors indef. If we as a group sign off on the rules as is I will place players in the minors and score points with them. When an issue is brought up I will be able to say there is no rule against it and that the RC chose not to add a scoring provision.

[Flash]

This RC should close the loopholes of leaving players on minor league rosters but allowing them to score. It takes two sentences to fix this. Furthermore, if we do eliminate EDR for kiln we should not add five more roster spots. 60 is enough.

Lastly players should not be allowed to sit in minors indef. If we as a group sign off on the rules as is I will place players in the minors and score points with them. When an issue is brought up I will be able to say there is no rule against it and that the RC chose not to add a scoring provision.

Are we in the same universe?  Did you even read the entire post?  Or did you do the same old thing and jump to an erroneous conclusion?

As a Co-Commissioner I feel obligated to respond to your comments, but it certainly is tiresome.  I guess we can entertain the rest of the league by engaging in a mindless post war, but I'm not sure I have the energy to keep answering the obvious.

First of all, the rosters are not increasing.  That was clearly stated, so I don't know why you'd bring that up.  The MiLB roster will remain at 20.  I'll repeat it so there is no confusion:  The MiLB roster will remain at 20.

Secondly, are you telling the rest of the league you are going to willingly cheat?  You really want to be known for that?   Do you think anyone agrees with you that having a 20 player MiLB roster authorizes cheating?  Are we to believe that you have been cheating all along because we have 20 EDRs on our rosters right now and can move them into our daily scoring line-ups?  Did a change in labels, EDR to MiLB, suddenly change a players scoring capabilities? 

I believe, from past experience in this league, that if any of us have a player who can help us score points, we will not let him stay on our MiLB rosters indefinitely.  Please take some time to review each roster in the league and you will find several players on each that are MiLB players with no fantasy scoring capabilities.  Then look at their EDR rosters, which are a part of their Fantrax rosters, and point out one player who can be used for scoring purposes.  There is not one roster that has 40 players on it where all 40 are capable of being used in a daily lineup for scoring purposes. 

I looked at the :SD: 40 man roster and I see 12 players with no MLB experience and three open roster spots on the :SD: EDR roster.  I'm trying to figure out how you could ever carry out your threats to cheat.  I'm all for playing Devil's advocate, but your points, warnings, and threats cannot be taken seriously when you portray scenarios that don't exist. As I've said before, there is not one GM, even you, who would blatantly cheat to score a few fantasy points.

Over the years I have watched, and read, a lot of the post wars you've engaged in and admired your determination and enthusiasm.  But on this one, I think you're way off.   I don't like to be so harsh, but the Rules Committee is trying to move the league in a positive direction and your constant allusion to things that don't exist do nothing to help us in that endeavor.

I know you will reply to this post because you can't help yourself.  But let me end by saying this.  You've essentially told the league you are willing to cheat as an act of sabotage, but you know, once you go down that road, there's no turning back. 

[joeshmoe]

A simple question...is a milb player eligible to score points?

[Flash]

A simple question...is a milb player eligible to score points?

No.

[joeshmoe]

No.

So why isnt it written into the rule?

[joeshmoe]

I looked over the proposal. I saw nothing about a player being able to score or not if they are on the milb. If there is no rule for or against players on the milb scoring. How can milb scoring be cheated, when there is no rule to have been broken?

If we are using unwritten rules that is bad form.

[Flash]

I looked over the proposal. I saw nothing about a player being able to score or not if they are on the milb. If there is no rule for or against players on the milb scoring. How can milb scoring be cheated, when there is no rule to have been broken?

If we are using unwritten rules that is bad form.

The MiLB players are on a separate 20 man roster and are not counted against our salary cap.  Therefore, they cannot be used in our daily lineups because to do so would be in violation of our roster and salary cap rules.

For our daily play, we have a separate 40 man MLB roster that is governed by our salary cap rules.  It is from that roster that we choose who will be in our daily lineups. 

Both of these rosters are listed on the ProFSL board, and yes, both are on our Fantrax rosters.  But we do not have the option of shuffling players back and forth between the two rosters on Fantrax.  We don't have that option right now with our present EDR players and we will not have it with our MiLB players if this proposal passes.  Why?  Because in each instance they are not a part of our MLB rosters.  The players on our 40 man MLB roster are the only ones we can use in our daily lineups.  I think you know that, but refuse to acknowledge it.

Maybe you have some reason for trying to be so difficult and make something out of nothing.  I don't think I'm writing anything that you don't already know.  Your criticism regarding an unwritten rule being bad form is not even remotely a concern because the rules are clear and concise. 

I'm sorry you don't agree with the rule, and as a member of the Rules Committee you are entitled to an opinion, but you've cast your vote, and voiced your dissatisfaction, but I do not see any other member of the Rules Committee agreeing with on any of the points you have raised.  Personally, I'm a bit saddened to see the EDR rule headed towards defeat.  I tried to preserve it with a compromise of 20 EDRs and 5 MiLBs because I felt obligated to do so.  However, like other GMs in this league, I have seen an MiLB roster used quite successfully in other leagues and I am perceptive enough to recognize that FGM is ready to move in that direction.  It's always hard to move away from one's history, but we are doing so with something that is easy to implement for the good of the league.

[joeshmoe]

I have read the rules and i see no such rule about which roster can be used for scoring. I see an EDR rule dictating removal or a player from that roster due to play, but you could use an EDR player to score under the prior format, for one day. The next day they needed to be placed on main roster.

This proposal is to remove the EDR. The new rules dont onclude a provision about scoring, and are, factually written to allow a player to score indefinitely against the cap. you are using the argument of, the way things are, but that isnt true. The way they are is due to the rule about EDR and mlb time. Remove that rule without a replacement and you have loopholes in rules.

Why is it hard to conceed this. If you added a rule youd have my vote. This is a decent idea but needs a point of clarification. Otherwise we will be discussing this in the future.

Lastly, Ernie, you have said a lot about my character. I am opposed to a rule because I believe it to be bad. But I havent attacked you. I understand disagreeing, but would appreciate less discussion of me and more about the rules themselves.

[Flash]

I give up. :doh:  I just don't see what I'm supposed to concede.

I think it's pretty clear which roster is used for scoring purposes.