ProFSL: Pro Fantasy Sports Leagues
Fantasy Leagues => Franchise NHL: Transactions => Franchise NHL => NHL Leagues => Franchise NHL: Completed Transactions => Topic started by: PsychoticPondGoons on May 07, 2015, 02:55:13 PM
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That's right. Market conditions are driving up the value of goalie contracts in the NHL and FNHL will be keeping up and probably a step ahead with projected extension value increases to kick in starting August 2016 at contract roll-over.
Top 10 and possibly Top 15 goalie salaries will be north of $10.0m.
UPDATED JANUARY 7, 2016
Here are the new Extension values for the TOP 10 Franchise NHL Goalies starting August 2016
Contract Roll-over date (approximately August 16th).
(TOP 10 GOALIE EXTENSIONS INCREASE EFFECTIVE AUGUST 2016)
1 10.4 >>> 14.3
2 10.2 >>> 13.5
3 9.9 >>> 12.9
4 9.7 >>> 12.3
5 9.5 >>> 11.7
6 9.3 >>> 11.1
7 9.1 >>> 10.5
8 8.9 >>> 9.9
9 8.7 >>> 9.4
10 8.5 >>> 8.9
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The highest base salary this yr in the NHL is supposed to be Shea Weber's $14m
Are you thinking of that as the top extension value or highed/lower?
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So I understand, what is the purpose of this increase?
The way I see it, it's to do one of these 3 things
To keep up with contract values of top NHL players? Or
Force owners to not hoard starting goalies? Or
A knuckleball to change things up in our cap league?
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So I understand, what is the purpose of this increase?
The way I see it, it's to do one of these 3 things
To keep up with contract values of top NHL players? Or
Force owners to not hoard starting goalies? Or
A knuckleball to change things up in our cap league?
ALL 3!
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Looked like JD might have been asking about raising the cap on skaters as well. If not then let me....with Toews and Kane at $10.5m and Stamkos soon to follow, are you thinking of raising the maximum values for other players as well? Just curious.
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I think it's important to note that salary per year is different from cap hit. It's easier to pay a guy 10.5m when his cap hit is only 8m.
Not to mention that Chicago (real life Chi-town) keeps running into cap trouble. They had to let Leddy go for nothing and they have to make some interesting moves this off-season.
Point is that we should be looking at cap hit for year and not salary. Real life teams can have variable contracts and we can't
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I think it's important to note that salary per year is different from cap hit. It's easier to pay a guy 10.5m when his cap hit is only 8m.
Not to mention that Chicago (real life Chi-town) keeps running into cap trouble. They had to let Leddy go for nothing and they have to make some interesting moves this off-season.
Point is that we should be looking at cap hit for year and not salary. Real life teams can have variable contracts and we can't
Good point. I think the variable contracts have been changed a lot to prevent the back-diving so that cap hits in the future will be more in line with salaries but yes we don't have the same flexibility. I know there's a CBA rule that caps any one players pay to 20% of the over-all team cap but I'm not sure if that relates to cap number or actual salary.
Anyways I think there was some general curiosity about whether the other positions would see a hike or if this is more to about adjusting for the league being skewed towards goalies.
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Anyways I think there was some general curiosity about whether the other positions would see a hike or if this is more to about adjusting for the league being skewed towards goalies.
More about moving away from teams being able to hold 2 starting goalies for any extended period of time give this is a league that rewards goalies.
I think it's important to note that salary per year is different from cap hit. It's easier to pay a guy 10.5m when his cap hit is only 8m.
Not to mention that Chicago (real life Chi-town) keeps running into cap trouble. They had to let Leddy go for nothing and they have to make some interesting moves this off-season.
You nailed it in your own post Izaman!
The NHL's Chicago Blackhawks example is what we want with respect to goalies.
FNHL teams will have to make choices. The high cost of a starting goalie will make teams really think long and hard about how they build their roster from the net out. It will lead to a few more FA skaters each yr.
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The highest base salary this yr in the NHL is supposed to be Shea Weber's $14m
Are you thinking of that as the top extension value or higher/lower?
Yes.
We're going to figure out the top end of the FNHL payscale so that it can be left for a few years. $15 or $16 sounds about right.
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Yes.
We're going to figure out the top end of the FNHL payscale so that it can be left for a few years. $15 or $16 sounds about right.
Hope you're only looking at the top-end and not pushing salaries up across the board. It would be very ugly having to pay a Jussi Rynnas type over $6m per. Even the $2.2m he commands now is rich. :toth:
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Hope you're only looking at the top-end and not pushing salaries up across the board. It would be very ugly having to pay a Jussi Rynnas type over $6m per. Even the $2.2m he commands now is rich. :toth:
:iatp:
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Hope you're only looking at the top-end and not pushing salaries up across the board. It would be very ugly having to pay a Jussi Rynnas type over $6m per. Even the $2.2m he commands now is rich. :toth:
I am sure it only impacts the top Goaltenders.
PPG said the top 5 Goaltenders would be affected but I would like to see it only for the top 10.
- DD
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It'll be goalies in the top 1-15... PPG will crunch numbers and post the goalie rankings that will be updated. I do feel top 8 or top 10 makes most sense.
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It'll be goalies in the top 1-15... PPG will crunch numbers and post the goalie rankings that will be updated. I do feel top 8 or top 10 makes most sense.
there is still a pending task on this: need to confirm the range of Goalie rankings this impacts top #1-10 or #1-15...
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What's the status on this PPG?
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You guys should probably look into revamping the list down through for goalies. When I revamped them I just did a 20% hike across the board. ( I did kind of a crappy job) Goalie extensions really need more of a stepped approach vs. the skaters extensions.
When you look at it the top 33 players in ftps last year were all goalies(except ovi, he is a freak) . So your top 30 highest paid players in the league should in a perfect world be all goalies. ie 30 teams 30 starting goalies.
Your current 30th goalie extension is only 5.9 highest is 10.4, which is too much of a drop off between starting goalies as they all produce somewhat similar numbers. You top 5 goalies should be probably in the 10-12 region , 6th to 30th should start dropping 10-8mill, 30th to 45 should take another steep dive since you are starting to get into backup territory with less than half the value of a full starter. 8mill drop to 4/5 mill
45 to 65 , 4/5mill to 2.5/3 mill , Anything after 65 is getting into speculation and should start a stead spike down to 1million (any goalie worth having on your pro roster should be at least 1mill per year)
***credit to Slackjack for our converstion and bringing out an obvious flaw in the mid section of the extensions***
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You guys should probably look into revamping the list down through for goalies. When I revamped them I just did a 20% hike across the board. ( I did kind of a crappy job) Goalie extensions really need more of a stepped approach vs. the skaters extensions.
When you look at it the top 33 players in ftps last year were all goalies(except ovi, he is a freak) . So your top 30 highest paid players in the league should in a perfect world be all goalies. ie 30 teams 30 starting goalies.
Your current 30th goalie extension is only 5.9 highest is 10.4, which is too much of a drop off between starting goalies as they all produce somewhat similar numbers. You top 5 goalies should be probably in the 10-12 region , 6th to 30th should start dropping 10-8mill, 30th to 45 should take another steep dive since you are starting to get into backup territory with less than half the value of a full starter. 8mill drop to 4/5 mill
45 to 65 , 4/5mill to 2.5/3 mill , Anything after 65 is getting into speculation and should start a stead spike down to 1million (any goalie worth having on your pro roster should be at least 1mill per year)
***credit to Slackjack for our converstion and bringing out an obvious flaw in the mid section of the extensions***
The Goalie Extensions were structured to ensure teams don't hoard Free Agent Goalie prospects without paying a steep price.
Because Goalie scoring is so damn off the charts in this league they have to be the highest earners. They are the mega stars of Franchise NHL so they will earn the most on extension deals. :thumbsup: And rightfully so man! I wouldn't have it any other way!
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The Goalie Extensions were structured to ensure teams don't hoard Free Agent Goalie prospects without paying a steep price.
Because Goalie scoring is so BooYah! off the charts in this league they have to be the highest earners. They are the mega stars of Franchise NHL so they will earn the most on extension deals. :thumbsup: And rightfully so man! I wouldn't have it any other way!
i am not saying teams dont need to pony up or that they goalies are too expensive. I am just saying there could be a better layout/divisions for the extensions. They are not like skaters and there are some definite divisions/cutoffs that goalies go from extreme value to useless.
Teams should definitely have to pay for production but I dont think making someone pay 5mill per year for a speculation goalie is good. I guess what i am saying in a round about way is yes increase to the top end goalies, but reduce the backend of goalies.
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We'll see after a few yrs. The new era of Goalie extensions only kicked in last yr so give it a little more time to play out.
Another way to position this is drafting goalies and holding them as prospects in the minors has gained more value.
i am not saying teams dont need to pony up or that they goalies are too expensive. I am just saying there could be a better layout/divisions for the extensions. They are not like skaters and there are some definite divisions/cutoffs that goalies go from extreme value to useless.
Teams should definitely have to pay for production but I dont think making someone pay 5mill per year for a speculation goalie is good. I guess what i am saying in a round about way is yes increase to the top end goalies, but reduce the backend of goalies.
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We'll see after a few yrs. The new era of Goalie extensions only kicked in last yr so give it a little more time to play out.
Another way to position this is drafting goalies and holding them as prospects in the minors has gained more value.
That is because you never changed Goalies as far as Entry Level Draft contracts are concerned.
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That is because you never changed Goalies as far as Entry Level Draft contracts are concerned.
Entry levek deals are meant to be favourable.
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PPG what is ETA on the new top tier goalie extensions?
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PPG what is ETA on the new top tier goalie extensions?
On it for October season start. :toast:
Got sick and almost died so catching up. LOL
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On it for October season start. :toast:
Got sick and almost died so catching up. LOL
I have been doing some thinking on this. do you think going up on goalie extensions even further is the best idea.. A top goalie would be eating up almost an 1/4 of a persons total cap space.. I think what you will see happen is Goalies will still continue to get their extensions no matter what and you are going to see an absolute crap ton of players/skaters going to FA.
Upping their extension cost is basically just trying reduce their value. This can be done by slightly decreasing their stats collection over a period of time. We currently award 0.25 pts for every save. What if you just reduced it by 0.01pts , for the next 5 seasons? you end up at 0.20 pts per save.
The average goalie in the league makes 1500 saves. 1500x .25 = 375ftps. 1500x.24= 360ftps. 1500x.20 = 300 ftps.
so next season the average goalie loses about 15ftps on the entire season but that would affect all teams equally.
The problem I have with doing large increases to the extensions is it will create large disparities between teams that have to extend goalies at the new rates and ones who have goalies at the old extension costs. It may take teams 5 years to get back to parity on goalie costs.
The other issue I see with raising costs is again creating huge price gaps between minor league developed goalies to when they have to be extended.
I dont want to throw a wrench in the plans, but just throwing this out for thought before we go escalating goalie prices that could in turn cause other issues down the road.
I really think we are at a good spot happy medium between extension costs and available cap to teams. bringing the goalie costs higher could tip that scale. We havent even seen the full effect of the last goalie extension costs on all teams.
By a very slow reduction in stats it will affect all teams equally but not adversely over a 5year period of time vs. extension cost increase that will affect all teams but at very different times over a 5 year period.
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I got to think the cost of extensions going up for the top tier goalies is going to force teams to make more choices. Resign, release, trade or other.
League's where the rules remain intact lead to stagnant activity IMO.
If I had to guess the increase is going to force teams to make moves versus sit back and hold a top goalie forever. Then the domino effect will do it's thing and there will be transactions of one sort or another. Holding an expensive top goalie means cutting cap elsewhere with reserve goalies or skaters.
Cap will only go up over time. It isn't going backwards at least not until the next collective bargaining agreement is needed in September 2022.
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Otherwise it's just PPG's way of raising hell around here. HA HA
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League's where the rules remain intact lead to stagnant activity IMO.
I categorically disagree with you on that one. The ebbs and flows of a league should come with the unpredictability of real-life, players performances and team needs not forced through rule changes. This isnt "big brother 16" expect the unexpected.
That aside, I am not complaining about the idea of making goalie decisions harder. I am just suggesting an alternative way to do it. If a company wants to make more profit on their candy bars they can A. charge more money OR B. Make the candy bar smaller but charge the same amount.
I am just suggesting the B option in this case because there is less chance of causing an imbalance elsewhere that will require a rule change, its probably a more fair approach as it affects all GMS at the same time (I wont say equally since a team with 2 starting goalies will be affected greater than a team with none, but the increased extensions is probably even less equal) and can be staged in a slower rate than 1 sweeping change to the extensions.
Thats not even bringing in the increased benefit to home grown goalies through the minors. All I will say there is I will trade anyone of my skaters in my minors for anyones goalie prospects. Send your offers please.
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I am totally against making anything smaller. I told my GF and I'm saying it here. HA HA
Seriously. I think the commish is stirring it with the Top Tier Goalies getting the big bump up. That is real world. Look at Weber, PK and Lundqvist's contract. front loaded and big numbers. Craziness.
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I believe the intent is to make the most value position in this league the most expensive and the one where you cannot hoard top goalies.
By making the orice adjustment, teams have to decide whether they can afford to have a second #1 goalie sitting on he bench at a cost of roughly 8-15 million annually or unlock the cap and buy skaters.
By doing so we hope to move towards the elimination of teams without a top goalie or a top backup goalie in a 50/50 timeshare role.
I am against adjusting scoring of any type because there is no real issue there and it doesnt solve the issue of limited goalie transactions in FNHL.
I have been doing some thinking on this. do you think going up on goalie extensions even further is the best idea.. A top goalie would be eating up almost an 1/4 of a persons total cap space.. I think what you will see happen is Goalies will still continue to get their extensions no matter what and you are going to see an absolute crap ton of players/skaters going to FA.
Upping their extension cost is basically just trying reduce their value. This can be done by slightly decreasing their stats collection over a period of time. We currently award 0.25 pts for every save. What if you just reduced it by 0.01pts , for the next 5 seasons? you end up at 0.20 pts per save.
The average goalie in the league makes 1500 saves. 1500x .25 = 375ftps. 1500x.24= 360ftps. 1500x.20 = 300 ftps.
so next season the average goalie loses about 15ftps on the entire season but that would affect all teams equally.
The problem I have with doing large increases to the extensions is it will create large disparities between teams that have to extend goalies at the new rates and ones who have goalies at the old extension costs. It may take teams 5 years to get back to parity on goalie costs.
The other issue I see with raising costs is again creating huge price gaps between minor league developed goalies to when they have to be extended.
I dont want to throw a wrench in the plans, but just throwing this out for thought before we go escalating goalie prices that could in turn cause other issues down the road.
I really think we are at a good spot happy medium between extension costs and available cap to teams. bringing the goalie costs higher could tip that scale. We havent even seen the full effect of the last goalie extension costs on all teams.
By a very slow reduction in stats it will affect all teams equally but not adversely over a 5year period of time vs. extension cost increase that will affect all teams but at very different times over a 5 year period.
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I believe the intent is to make the most value position in this league the most expensive and the one where you cannot hoard top goalies.
By making the orice adjustment, teams have to decide whether they can afford to have a second #1 goalie sitting on he bench at a cost of roughly 8-15 million annually or unlock the cap and buy skaters.
By doing so we hope to move towards the elimination of teams without a top goalie or a top backup goalie in a 50/50 timeshare role.
I am against adjusting scoring of any type because there is no real issue there and it doesnt solve the issue of limited goalie transactions in FNHL.
Fair enough. It is 6 or one half dozen the other both accomplish the same thing in my book which is limits the usefulness of carrying two goalies where your 2nd goalie may only be getting a 1/4 of the starts.
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Top 10 Goalie extension values will be going up in 2016-17.
More to come soon!
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Top 10 Goalie extension values will be going up in 2016-17.
More to come soon!
Here are the new Extension values for the TOP 10 Franchise NHL Goalies starting August 2016
Contract Roll-over date (approximately August 16th).
(TOP 10 GOALIE EXTENSIONS INCREASE EFFECTIVE AUGUST 2016)
1 10.4 >>> 14.3
2 10.2 >>> 13.5
3 9.9 >>> 12.9
4 9.7 >>> 12.3
5 9.5 >>> 11.7
6 9.3 >>> 11.1
7 9.1 >>> 10.5
8 8.9 >>> 9.9
9 8.7 >>> 9.4
10 8.5 >>> 8.9
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Here are the new Extension values for the TOP 10 Franchise NHL Goalies starting August 2016
Contract Roll-over date (approximately August 16th).
(TOP 10 GOALIE EXTENSIONS INCREASE EFFECTIVE AUGUST 2016)
1 10.4 >>> 14.3
2 10.2 >>> 13.5
3 9.9 >>> 12.9
4 9.7 >>> 12.3
5 9.5 >>> 11.7
6 9.3 >>> 11.1
7 9.1 >>> 10.5
8 8.9 >>> 9.9
9 8.7 >>> 9.4
10 8.5 >>> 8.9
Oh damn.
Rask has an extension due nxt yr. hope he sucs early nxt yr.
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Oh BooYah! .
Rask has an extension due nxt yr. hope he sucs early nxt yr.
You mean you hope Rask continues his downward trend LOL