Author Topic: Discussion-Rule Book Revision Pt.2  (Read 781 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline BHows

  • Legend
  • *****
  • Join Date: Oct 2009
  • Posts: 12549
  • Bonus inPoints: 3
    • :CIN-NFL:
    • :Blank:
    • :Blank:
    • :Kentucky:
    • :CIN:
    • View Profile
Discussion-Rule Book Revision Pt.2
« on: September 20, 2015, 11:39:12 AM »
Phase 2 of the Rule Book Revision is open for discussion.
The topics are:
Salary Cap Structure
MLB Effects
Committees
The first two are mainly structural but "Committees" contains a lot of new information. Again, the original rules are in black with any proposed changes in red.
Please feel free to discuss on this thread. Discussion will be open for a minimum of 1 week.
funny
0
like
0
dislike
0
No reactions
No reactions
No reactions
2022 WCB2 Champions

Offline papps

  • Legend
  • *****
  • Join Date: Apr 2010
  • Posts: 8632
  • Bonus inPoints: 9
    • :PHI-NFL:
    • :PHI-NBA:
    • :PHI-NHL:
    • :Blank:
    • :PHI:
    • View Profile
Re: Discussion-Rule Book Revision Pt.2
« Reply #1 on: September 21, 2015, 10:36:22 AM »
First I'd like to say is great job on the rewriting of the rules Rick!  I think we can all agree that updating the rules is needed and I do appreciate the time you are putting in. 

I do have a couple questions pertaining to the rules for trade approval and the trade committee.  My first question is in the new rules under Item VI C-1.0 point 5 it says that a TC member may be replaced if there is a continued measure of inactivity.  Do you think we need to define what constitutes inactivity?  Is it simply commissioner's discretion or should we put a threshold in place?  Maybe something like failure to vote on 3-4 trades in a row comes an activity warning and after that replacement?

My second question has to do with the trade approval/veto process.  As we all know there was a well documented dispute over one of my trades late in the season.  Do you think we need to have a minimum amount of votes built in on a trade?  I don't think one vote should be the deciding factor on somebody's trade.  I do recognize the rule stating simple majority but I do believe there should be a minimum amount of votes in any trade.  Maybe if after 48 hours if the minimum amount of votes are not met the trade stays on the board for another 24 hours and the TC members are contacted to vote?

Again, great job to you and Flash for taking on the thankless job of keeping this league going.  I appreciate all your efforts.
funny
0
like
0
dislike
0
No reactions
No reactions
No reactions
🏆 - 2021 NFL Live Champion :TB-NFL:
🏆 - 2020 Bush League Champion :PHI:
🏆 - 2018 Franchise GM Champion :PHI:
🏆 - 2018 The League Champion :PIT-NFL:
🏆 - 2016 Moneyball II Champion :BOS:
🏆 - 2010 Agents vs GMs Champion :PHI:

Offline BHows

  • Legend
  • *****
  • Join Date: Oct 2009
  • Posts: 12549
  • Bonus inPoints: 3
    • :CIN-NFL:
    • :Blank:
    • :Blank:
    • :Kentucky:
    • :CIN:
    • View Profile
Re: Discussion-Rule Book Revision Pt.2
« Reply #2 on: September 21, 2015, 11:26:08 AM »
As far as I know, the only mention of inactivity is in Item AI B-1.0 "Failure to do so may result in your dismissal if you don't respond to PMs within 2 weeks." I remember a long discussion on the issue and, at one point, Jake actually monitored activity.
I'm not sure activity is the issue though. I'm not so sure that no vote at all isn't a TC member's way of vetoing a trade without the involvement.
As far as the single vote- Item VI C-2.0 Line 6 does say "If the 48 hour time period passes, the trade will be ruled valid if it receives at least two approvals." As I'm sure you know, that was part of an amendment that was passed recently. It is part of the rules as currently written and would need to be amended at a later date. What I am trying to do now is basically reorganizing.
funny
0
like
0
dislike
0
No reactions
No reactions
No reactions
2022 WCB2 Champions

Offline Flash

  • *ProFSL Staff
  • Legend
  • *****
  • Join Date: Sep 2010
  • Posts: 23232
  • Bonus inPoints: 319
    • :SFO:
    • :GS:
    • :SJ:
    • :California:
    • :UnitedStates:
    • :SF:
    • View Profile
Re: Discussion-Rule Book Revision Pt.2
« Reply #3 on: September 21, 2015, 02:55:12 PM »
Since we are discussing the matter, I would chime in that I believe our Trade Approval Process works as it is written and there is no need for any further amendments.

Going back through league archives, the trade approval process has been a long-standing issue.  In December 2013 to January 2014, a controversy emerged over a trade between the Reds and the White Sox.  There were two things at issue:  length of time on the FGM board without approval and approval of a trade that had three vetoes (two of the vetoes posted had no explanation).

In October of 2014, in a trade between the Phillies and the Rockies, the issue of approval surfaced again.  This time it concerned minimum approvals--the trade received 4 approvals and two vetoes.  The Trade Committee had 7 members and a TC member was involved in the trade, so the trade was disapproved by the Commissioner because it did not receive a minimum of 5 approvals (and not because it received 2 vetoes).  The reasons for a veto were also questioned, with the main objection being that GMs should be able to manage their teams the way they want.

The current Trade Approval Process was adopted in February 2015 by consensus of the Trade Committee.  It has effectively dealt with the issue of timely approval with the use of the 48 hour window.  While setting a five vote approval as goal for the Trade Committee, it has been established that a two vote minimum can be used as a viable approval standard if there is only one veto.  It has also been established that two vetoes constitute an automatic disapproval and required a posting of a rationale for a given veto.  Of course, what constitutes a fair trade, and why a veto is rendered, will continue to be at issue because the perspective of a TC member is a variable that cannot be standardized.   

The disputed trade referenced is one between the Reds and the Phillies.  That misunderstanding
centered on the difference between a disapproval and an invalidation.  Even though a second veto was posted 24 hours after the 48 hour window expired (along with an approval), the trade was not vetoed.  It simply did not get the necessary votes, for or against, in the established time frame and was moved to the Invalid Transactions section.  The trade was left on the board for 60 hours before any action was taken, and it could have been reposted if either GM had so desired.  Although my explanation at the time was dismissed as spin at the time, it nonetheless, points to the implementation and whether the process works.  Without seeking to stir up any old arguments, I would offer that we have established a working model for other leagues to follow, and after using it this past season, we have demonstrated that it works.

In regards to activity, there are a variety of times when I send PM's to the Trade Committee members when there is a trade on the board.  There have been other times when participating GMs send a similar PM to all Trade Committee members to garner the necessary votes. 
funny
0
like
0
dislike
0
No reactions
No reactions
No reactions
🏆 2021 FGM World Series Champion - :SF:
🏆 2017 WCB2 World Series Champion - :SD:
🏆 2021 BSN Football Mt West Champion :UNLV:
🏆 2021 BSN Football Big 10 Champion -  :Nebraska:
🏆 2021 BSN Football Pac-12 Champion :California:

Offline BHows

  • Legend
  • *****
  • Join Date: Oct 2009
  • Posts: 12549
  • Bonus inPoints: 3
    • :CIN-NFL:
    • :Blank:
    • :Blank:
    • :Kentucky:
    • :CIN:
    • View Profile
Re: Discussion-Rule Book Revision Pt.2
« Reply #4 on: September 21, 2015, 04:39:43 PM »
I have tried to make trades as visible as I can and have also contacted TC members regarding trades on the board.
As far as I'm concerned I feel that it's totally legitimate for GMs to contact TC members personally about trades they have pending.
funny
0
like
0
dislike
0
No reactions
No reactions
No reactions
2022 WCB2 Champions

 

Forum Search


Quick Profile

 
 
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

* Chat Room

Refresh History
  • dbreer23: Brian CLE PM
    May 19, 2024, 01:49:57 PM
  • Braves155: PM BAB
    May 19, 2024, 03:29:20 PM
  • indiansnation: Bayareaballers pm trade posted in fgm
    May 19, 2024, 03:56:17 PM
  • indiansnation: Braves ill send u message soon
    May 19, 2024, 03:56:32 PM
  • indiansnation: Dbreer23 pm
    May 19, 2024, 03:58:46 PM
  • indiansnation: Braves155 pm
    May 19, 2024, 04:35:11 PM
  • indiansnation: Watching boston kick the living crap out of cardinals
    May 19, 2024, 04:53:49 PM
  • Braves155: Great seeing the Knicks get schooled
    May 19, 2024, 06:37:35 PM
  • Rhino7: I agree, pacers will be a better match vs Celtics
    May 19, 2024, 07:02:21 PM
  • Braves155: But just like anytime Stephen A. gets hyped for the Knicks, they disappear in big games
    May 19, 2024, 07:08:00 PM
  • TheGOAT: Celtics would probably win it all
    May 19, 2024, 07:20:01 PM
  • Braves155: Looking forward to TWolves-Nuggets tonight
    May 19, 2024, 07:22:40 PM
  • TheGOAT: Around for trade talks in NFL Live
    May 19, 2024, 08:07:18 PM
  • Braves155: Likewise
    May 19, 2024, 08:22:40 PM
  • Jwalkerjr88: What you looking for? @Thegoat?
    May 19, 2024, 11:01:43 PM
  • Rhino7: Down goes the Champs! Nuggs out
    May 19, 2024, 11:56:44 PM
  • Daddy: That Minnesota NBA LIVE team aint lookin too bad right now. Should be fun!
    Yesterday at 12:00:46 AM
  • Rhino7: Good team except the contracts
    Yesterday at 03:09:09 PM
  • Daddy: Youve seen them? We havent completely structured all that yet. Weve got expansion and other factors that the real Wolves dont face.
    Yesterday at 03:39:40 PM
  • Daddy: My comment on the real Wolves are if they win a chip then there is no such things as bad contracts. The point of all contracts are to win Championships.
    Yesterday at 03:40:57 PM
  • STLBlues91: I will be around the rest of the day to talk deals. Tomorrow I will be around after work but plan on being in some spreadsheets most the day
    Yesterday at 05:04:22 PM
  • Rhino7: No, haven’t seen them except on spotrac
    Yesterday at 05:33:13 PM
  • Daddy: @Rhino7 the rumor is they've got a decent GM in both leagues. Especially NBA LIVE. (Howwwwwwwl)
    Yesterday at 07:13:40 PM
  • STLBlues91: Well Vegas is ready to grab one of the players on the roster
    Yesterday at 07:17:34 PM
  • Daddy: Lol, Seattle too Im sure.:rofl:
    Yesterday at 07:43:10 PM
  • Daddy: I will leak this... Each team will be allowed to protect 5 and each team can only lose one player to expansion
    Yesterday at 07:44:21 PM
  • Daddy: 30 teams to draw from = 15 players each
    Yesterday at 07:44:57 PM
  • STLBlues91: Id also imagine trading and all that can happen. Like pick a guy to trade to another team to pick up other assets
    Yesterday at 07:45:25 PM
  • Daddy: You know LIVE rules. Once they are yours you can do whatever you like.
    Yesterday at 07:46:32 PM
  • STLBlues91: Yeah had to just check. So a deadline to select the keepers. Then a few days for the selection. Me and Seattle alternate picks?
    Yesterday at 07:47:47 PM
  • Daddy: The expansion draft is LIVE alternating picks until both teams have 15 players like the NBA All Star teams get picked.
    Yesterday at 07:48:04 PM
  • BayAreaBallers: oh Crap
    Yesterday at 07:49:27 PM
  • BayAreaBallers: this is interesting w my team
    Yesterday at 07:49:42 PM
  • BayAreaBallers: who to protect outside the obvious
    Yesterday at 07:49:52 PM
  • STLBlues91: Sounds good I didnt know if it would be like the NHL expansion with seattle where they get posted or live broadcasting
    Yesterday at 07:50:02 PM
  • Daddy: The "Expansion draft" will be a LIVE Event & followed by the Entry Draft where Vegas/Seattle also will start off with picks #1 & #2.
    Yesterday at 07:50:06 PM
  • Daddy: We doing BIG Crap with this basketball league. Buckle up!
    Yesterday at 07:50:46 PM
  • Daddy: NBA LIVE is codenamed "The "Matrix" for all the numbers we running. Its currently being built.
    Yesterday at 07:52:40 PM
  • STLBlues91: Well I will get my roster breakdown before the live expansion since I am done working for the summer next Wednesday
    Yesterday at 08:01:38 PM
  • Daddy: NHL LIVE will drop first. Hockey guys trade like crazy. Good luck. :)
    Yesterday at 08:12:04 PM
  • STLBlues91: Yeah working on that spreadsheet and a few fixes on it. May do some slight visual adds and then to NCAA football sheet which I got going as well
    Yesterday at 08:48:21 PM
  • Daddy: :toth: the best moderator team on the planet. Thanks! :toth:
    Yesterday at 09:14:11 PM
  • Daddy: Can you imagine a league(s).  Where EVERY player that becomes a professional has value.. and 30-32 teams have 30-32 different people are actively determining that value?
    Today at 01:46:50 AM
  • Daddy: Where you dont wait for trades to happen on scoring sites or SS updates and the only thing asked of you is to run your own franchise and see how good you are. On an EVEN playing field.
    Today at 01:48:59 AM
  • Daddy: Its already near impossible to get into NFL LIVE. We had to start up a 64 team league just to accommodate the waiting list. True Story.
    Today at 01:55:29 AM
  • Daddy: Once full. NBA, NHL, & NCAAs will be very difficult to get into. People dont just walk away from LIVE often and when they do... They usually want back in. Legit dont miss your team in your sports. Get them while you can.
    Today at 02:00:44 AM
  • IndianaBuc: RyanJames5 PM
    Today at 09:13:54 AM
  • indiansnation: Hey guys take a look at these baseball mugs
    Today at 01:53:49 PM
  • indiansnation: [link]
    Today at 01:53:56 PM
  • STLBlues91: Feel free to message I will be around for talks as I work on some spreadsheets
    Today at 04:43:35 PM