Need New Scoring System

[yahoolando]

We need to change the scoring in this league.

I currently haven't had a chance to analyse it but it makes zero sense to me in regards to the value of certain players.

I want to eliminate any defence scoring as we don't draft players based on defence and never will.

I would like to change it to something like the following but not until the extension period is over so we all have the same variables for the extensions.

This is posted for discussion purposes and by no means is this written in stone but I think something needs to change and I am sure a few of you do as well.

Hitting
Hits (H)  1
Strikeout (SO) -2
Home Runs (HR)   2
Runs Batted In (RBI)   2
Runs Scored (R)   2
Stolen Bases (SB)   1.5
Caught Stealing (CS) -1.5
Walks (BB)   2
Total Bases (TB)     1.5
Grounded Into Double Play (GIDP)  -2

Pitching
Blown Saves (BS)   -10
Earned Runs Allowed (ER)   -3
Hits Allowed (H)   -1
Holds (Hld)   5
Quality Starts (QS)   5
Saves (Sv)   10
Strikeouts (K)   3
Walks Allowed (BB)   -1.5
Wins (W)   10
Losses (L)   -5
Shutout (ShO)  5

In our league Victor Martinez was the 9th ranked Catcher because he only produced 103 Put-outs.  But hit .301 with 14 HR and 83 RBI in 159 games.  This is absurd.

2013 Catcher Ranks (AFB)
FP     PPG    Name
655.4  4.82   Yadier Molina
648.6  4.38   Buster Posey
639.6  4.35   Jonathan Lucroy
637.2  4.14   Carlos Santana
601.8  4.07   Matt Wieters
596.6  4.29   Mike Napoli
576.6  4.18   Salvador Perez
532.4  3.97   AJ Pierzynski
516.2  3.25   Victor Martinez
489.8  4.05   Jarrod Saltalamacchia

With my new stats Martinez would be the top ranked catcher.

2013 Catcher Ranks - new scoring layout
FP     PPG    Name
844.8  5.31   Victor Martinez
810.9  5.27   Carlos Sanatana
768.8  5.65   Yadier Molina
761.4  5.18   Jonathan Lucroy
758.4  5.12   Buster Posey
649.0  4.39   Matt Wieters
642.5  4.66   Salvador Perez
632.4  5.60   Joe Mauer
619.9  4.46   Mike Napoli
587.4  4.85   Wilin Rosario

In our league the way it is Yadier Molina has more PPG at 4.82 than Mike Trout at 4.51 or Andrew McCutcheon at 3.95 PPG!

With the new scoring Trout produces 7.17 PPG and McCutcheon 6.3 PPG.

Lets make the scoring based on how we feel fantasy players should be valued.  Depth is one thing.  But quality should rank ahead of quantity more often that not!

[seanrmgallagher]

I totally agree that the scoring for this league is screwed up. First basemen/Catchers become way more valuable comparatively. That being said, this league has existed for a while, and I have personally made a lot of moves based on the scoring system as is. For instance, I would not have traded for Ike Davis and John Jaso or pushed to sign James Loney and Carlos Ruiz last year. So, changing the rules would hurt my team as it is set up pretty significantly.

That being said, while I do not want the scoring to change, I like the changes to the offense. I disagree that fielding shouldn't be incorporated though. The previous system was obviously flawed, but fielding is a huge part of evaluating players- I would suggest trying to incorporate fielding in a point system the way that WAR tries to use it. There are fantasy leagues that use a point system like that. Also, I think that the previous point system for pitching was not bad for our league. It may have overvalued closers/set-up men compared to real-life value, but it seemed fair when you compared player's performance.

[Bazinga McCringa]

Having examined the scoring system, I agree that a revamp of it might be nice, and I would be in favor of removing defense entirely, due to the weight it places on particular positions. However, I can't understand the idea of giving two points for a homer, but losing 10 for a blown save. With the proposed scoring system, pitchers are valued almost too heavily, however, the metrics used are good at giving more value to depth than talent.

[nicole]

The idea behind the league has been to be close to what Major league baseball is.  Defense is apart of that.  Using V-Mart as an example is not a good one.  He barely played the field and is more of a DH.  He will not even qualify as a catcher.  Actually he will only qualify as UT. He did not have enough to qualify at catcher nor at 1st. He should be behind Yadier, Buster and others.  You have Napoli listed there as well and he will not qualify at Catcher either.  I think the scoring system should stay as is.

[chrisetc21]

I agree that the scoring should be changed, I sent Lando a message about this a while back.  However, I do agree that defense should play a role.  I prefer more of a WAR scoring system.  One in which players who are great defensively get credit for that.  That way you can't just load up on DH's and horrible fielders that just put up offensive numbers.  That's not realistic.   

One other problem I see if position eligibility.  There are players eligible for all kinds of positions that they rarely if ever play. 

[Maydab23]

I think everybody is making some good points. I agree that it is unfortunate that owners who have been around a while have built their teams around this scoring system and might be adversely affected if it is changed. I also agree with Nicole that if this league is founded on the principle of mirroring MLB it should incorporate defense and V-Mart does not deserve to be the best C nor even a top 5 catcher. While scoring the quality of defense would be difficult in AFB, defense does deserve to be counted for something, if nothing else just to detract value from DH types who obviously don't provide the same value to their MLB teams as players who play the field.

That said there are some clear flaws in scoring that must be addressed in my opinion. Any league that values Anthony Rizzo (719.2) more than Mike Trout (708.8) is clearly flawed. In an effort to be non-biased (as the Angels GM) there is no way Mark Trumbo (643) should be valued more than Andrew McCutchen (619.4).

As a newbie to the league and combing through the stats and rankings it seems everything works pretty well in the scoring except for PO. The fact that 15 out of the 20 best position players are 1B eligible while only 1 primarily plays OF goes to show that it is unrealistic. While I agree with Nicole that the Catchers within themselves are already ranked appropriately because it most closely resembles MLB value it would be hypocritical to not do something about the PO problem.

As far as fixes to the system my recommendation would be to decrease PO from 0.2 to 0.1

This would help decrease the wide advantage 1B have over others (and to a lesser extent C).

The rankings of the 4 players I mentioned earlier would change to:
Trout  672.9
Rizzo 590.2
McCutchen 587.3
Trumbo 546.5

While I still think McCutchen should be more valuable than Rizzo it at least addresses the problem and makes the league more realistic as far as position player value.

It is unfortunate that rules would change after people built clubs according to these rules but if this league is to be what it says it is it must make a change to more closely resemble position player value. As it stands now it is very skewed and unrealistic. In my opinion the change should happen now at the beginning of the offseason.

Sorry that my first post ran so long.

Thanks,
Shane

[Jss0062]

These are my suggestions. 

Offense
A single is equal to a walk.  For Lando's suggestion above a walk would need to equal 2.5 points.

No bonus points for a HR, in the current system a HR is worth 8 points (H, R, 2RBI, 4 TB) in the above suggestion it would be worth 13 (H, 2 HR,2RBI, 2 R, 6 TB) not counting the RBIs

Runs and RBIs 1 point each,  these are highly dependent on the team in front of and behind the player in the lineup.

Minimal K penalty if any, after all it is just another out.  I would suggest -.25 points per out as the league average in 2013 was .253 batting average.  DP would count as 2.

I like total bases being worth 1.5 as it rewards power

Net Steals +1.5, extra bases taken +1, This rewards baserunning and makes the speedy guys be valued closer to the power guys

Defense

Assists .3, Putouts .1  This eliminates the big advantage 1B and C get by being the primary out makers.  Errors = -2, This some what equalizes the error difference between infielders and outfielders

Pitching

IP = 3

Wins +3, Losses -3, These are very team dependent statistics. 

Holds and Saves are equal at +2, Blown Saves -3 again team dependent stats.

walks allowed -1, TB allowed x -1  Can't score if they can't get on base

Earned Runs Allowed -1

Ks +1
 
A bonus of +3 for a High Quality Start (7IP <3ER)

A bonus of +3 for a complete game, +5 for a shutout

Fantasy Baseball is about the the individual players, so the individual stats should be focused on the stats that takes the team around the player to also be good should be lowered in value.

[yahoolando]

Some good ideas for sure but, the teams that have built their teams have built them in a league where there only about 10 owners that pay attention. I had a good team too but feel things need to change.

Sure defense is important in the real world but we aren't making a trade in fantasy because a guy plays great defense. PO don't resemble good defense. Mccutcheon plays great defense but isn't rewarded for it as he is OF. The defensive stats are joke to me.

POs for a catcher doesn't mean he is a great defensive catcher it just means the pitchers get a lot of Ks.  Prime example if you use scapegoat Vmart once again. In 2010 he ranked 4th in the league for Catchers and Putouts.  We all know why.

[chrisetc21]

What is FanTrax's capabilities in terms of defensive stats?  Do they have any of these?

Defensive WAR
Range Factor
Runs Saved

[yahoolando]

What is FanTrax's capabilities in terms of defensive stats?  Do they have any of these?

Defensive WAR
Range Factor
Runs Saved

No they don't. Scoring can be different per position though.  But hat being said an OF assist happens once a week maybe twice.  Why should this stat impact the scoring when I am not drafting a defensive OF.